Wow. So, one of the questions I also have is when we do think about topics at work, there are a number of things right now that feel really explosive around politics, and even things that you would've once thought are very neutral now might feel kind of loaded. Do you think there are topics that should be off limits at work?

Nihal Arthanayake is author of Let’s Talk: How to Have Better Conversations You highlight how, in meetings with loyalists, Mary McAleese spoke about being “good neighbours” rather than discussing politics. Is that the key to a healthy conversation: focusing on common ground? Read this fascinating book and you'll become a better listener, a better conversationalist and better company' Adam Kay'A brilliant book on the art of conversation' Matt Haig'A compulsory book for these divided times' Sathnam Sanghera'An intriguing exploration of the importance of a proper chinwag' Sara Cox'A terrific book from a terrific broadcaster. Modern workers have no idea how to function as a healthy team. That is just the truth. And so, if you just are training them in how to be team members, in other words saying, "Listen, let's learn how to collaborate and coordinate, and we don't care if you like each other because it doesn't matter. We're not going to force you to like anybody, you just have to be respectful and collaborate well." That's going to give them all kinds of benefits. But banning those conversations is just going to send morale straight into the toilet and frankly increase your turnover rate. Nihal interviews a range of people for whom communication is a key part of their life and business, whilst blending in some of his own stories and experiences along the way, to highlight his key recommendations for the importance of open and varied communication, and how we need to improve in ‘the art of conversation’. I like that he uses the final chapter to summarise the majority of the key points from his interviewees.

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In 2012, a competition in Latvia broke the world record for the longest telephone conversation. How long did this record-breaking conversation last?

That was good. Thank you so much for an amazing conversation today. I certainly felt the pressure, so hopefully from every podcast now on, I will get better and better following your advice in this episode. So, thank you for spending your time with us today. I loved having you on the show. Nihal Arthanayake: “After I interviewed her for her memoir and I knew I was writing a book about conversation, honestly, how could I not have her in the book? It’s one of the starkest examples – the Northern Ireland peace process – of what is possible in conversation… You also have to be willing to have the door slammed in your face a few times.” A lot of public speech takes place today in the performative space of social media. Are we losing the ability to hold a conversation?But don’t kid yourself into thinking this is going to be easy. It’s not, it’s hard. Put away the electronics if you can and focus on what’s being said (not how it relates to you, or what you want to say next). Two key thoughts, before you go

Something can be considered a good conversation if it does what the people involved want it to do,” Heyman said. “People have a wide variety of goals in conversations, and in some cases the goals are strategic, such as convincing someone to agree with you or getting them to realize that you exist. These kinds of conversations are important, but they don’t interest me all that much. And just just to build on that point, again, the the nuances around company culture, ethos, vision values, how does the senior leadership team measure someone’s performance against those types of behaviours? Because sometimes it can be quite subjective around how well someone is or isn’t achieving against those elements. How was the senior leadership team? Would they measure those? And those nuances?As a British Asian boy growing up in a white community, Nihal also thinks conversation was a way for him to make friends and find protection. He says having conversations was a s urvival instinct - the human instinct to do something in a dangerous situation that will keep them safe from harm. Intentionally exposing people to shared experiences also works. “Think of how book clubs can let people discuss values based on a shared experience in a nonthreatening way,” Heyman said. “I encourage people to get creative in trying out new activities that promote learning and everyone feeling included. If the activity is fun or funny, that is an added bonus.” The key word there is performative. I don’t think we should believe that when we are sharing on social media we are having a conversation. It’s not really a dialogue – you think it is but it’s not – it’s a monologue. It’s a series of opinions. Brilliant, and absolutely, I think broadband is gonna be key to everyone’s world at the moment. And I’m sure many of us listening today, or many of our listeners have probably experienced the drop out so can actually vouch and be with you on that journey and and wish you all the best at bringing that connectivity and pushing your speeds higher. So thanks, Richard.

if you're really engaging with someone you've got to enter their space and be whoever you need to be within that space. But there is a core of who you are that remains constant. Oh, that's a fantastic story. And you certainly don't want to be someone who ends up becoming CEO and does interviews and you end up looking like a Muppet in your interviews when you're furious.

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Human beings are group thinkers. We are a hive mind. That is how we do our best thinking. And yet, leaders have this tendency to narrow and narrow and narrow the number of decision makers down. And I highly encourage you to stop doing that. You are so much more likely to make decisions that you may not like but are better and going to lead to better outcomes if you open it up. And be brave, be courageous, and open it up to everyone. The janitorial staff. I'll give you just one example from the book, The Wisdom of Crowds, and other places that cite it. At one point, the US government lost a submarine in the Atlantic Ocean, and they brought in the best experts they could find to figure out where the submarine was. Could not find it. So, one of the people on the team said, "You know what? I'm just going to take a poll."